The European secular question is still the same old question.

The simple question is: "Is man basically good or evil?" If one believes, along with most of the secular world, that man is basically good (and always has been),  then let man determine the rules and values. However, if one believes, with Christians and their Jewish ancestors, that man is basically evil, then God must determine the rules and values.

The God believers constantly strive to obey the laws of the Creator, like a pot on the wheel following the hand of the potter, rather than like clay fallen from the wheel trying to determine it's own shape. Only the creator and designer writes the assembly and instruction manual.

Man has indeed fallen, the evidence is all around us. ... A few - like Mother Teresa, Martin Luther King, William Wilberforce, Dietrich Bonhoeffer, et. al.,  prove the simple truth, man must strive to overcome by following his Creator.

Man is evil, and cannot write his own laws. We must let God write the law on our hearts. As Jesus said to the Pharisees when asked about the law and divorce: "It was because your hearts are hardened that Moses wrote laws." (Mark 10:5)

Jerry Emerson, Dover, Delaware, US

Given that the wars of the 20th century were caused by the materialism of the late 19th century and the elevation of the State above the Church, it is ironic that Europeans seek salvation in a socialist version of materialism and statism. The result is a superstate like the Soviet Union, but without the militarism.

John Schuh, Lake Dallas, Texas, USA

The debate about Islam in Europe is founded on a misunderstaning. Islam is not new to Europe.

al'Andalusia (Islamic Spain) was the Islamic forum through which aspects of Islamic mathematics, astrology, spirituality, mysticism, and science permeated European society and affected the development of Europe as a whole. Thousands of Muslims still live in southern Spain and much of the architecture and ambience of Spanish cities can be seen in cities of the Middle East.

Through the Ottoman Empire - even in areas outside the empire's control - millions of Europeans converted to Islam. A majority of people - of Caucasian, Slavic, and other "white" races - are still Muslim in countries like Bosnia-Herzegovina and Albania. Ancient Islamic communities, made up of the descendants of Ottoman-era converts, still exist in most of Eastern Europe - including Poland and Bulgaria.

The idea of Europe as a place with an exclusively Christian heritage is a misconception. Europe would be immeasurably less beautiful, valuable, and interesting without the Muslims and Jews - who contributed to the success of this continent far beyond their numbers.

Mila Knezevic, Sarajevo, Bosnia-Herzegovina

Faith vs. reason, religion and spirituality vs. secular rationality. Both are needed in human life. These contrasting views may appear to be antagonistic, but they are not. They both create psychic energy and a value system necessary for living and coping with the stresses and strains. Extremism in any direction is ultimately detrimental to society.

Just see the results of free rational liberal secularism: permissive sex, child porn, drugs, crime, falling birth rate, not enough people to work. So what do we do? We import [labor] from foreign countries. Extreme materialism, unwillingness to share with the less fortunate.

See the results of fundamentalism: repression, tyranny, oppression of minorities and women, economic stagnation, burgeoning population and no jobs. ...

Many towns in Europe and US hardly have any young children. We abort one million unborn every year. We are committing demographic suicide. Why? Because our personal pleasures and lifestyles are far more important than ... raising a family, and creating healthy responsible citizens.

Victor Sabins, LaCrosse, Wisc., USA

I lived in Germany and England for some eight years and found their respect for religion most pleasant. It is private to them, and they do not suffer from fundamentalism, by and large. I think they have the right balance between the secular and the religious. This seems to me to contribute to a more relaxed society there.

Jean Mitchell, Scarsdale, N.Y., USA

As someone who has lived in Europe and America, I would say that this surge of Evangelical enthusiasm [in the US] is merely representative of the poor educational experience for the mainstream American.

Europe is progressing in education and social conscientiousness. America is stagnant in the educational experience of its general population. Once in the US university system, the educational experience becomes average to above average for world standards, but the average American with a high school diploma is ripe for fundamentalist thinking.

Also, the amount of immigration to the US from poor countries with low education rates has been high in the last 25 years, especially the last 10 years, and would attribute to the rise in the religious.

Our general poplution is holding on fast to "the way things used to be" because things are changing so rapidly. God, church, and "Old Glory" are symbols of the customs [traditionalists] know and don't want to see changed. This country was founded on the principals of religious freedom, realizing that, with a secular government, we all are free to worship as we please – or not to worship if we please.

I think we will come back to our senses soon enough. Europe realizes our growing pains and will be patient – and hopefully guiding – if our values stray.

J.E.G., Texas, USA

I think Europe's got it right. Unless everyone converts to one religion, we have to cooperate based on something other than religious values. The only thing left is secularism, and from secular humanism you can get a moral system that can be applied more generally.

Really, if you want the right to be Christian (and not be immoral by imposing your religion on others), then you have to accept living in a secular society.

I've never understood why it's so important to American Christians to live in a Christian society. If you think you will lose your faith living in a secular society, maybe your faith is the problem, not the secular society.

Teresa, Urbana, Ill., USA

A distinction between religion and spirituality is needed. It is my experience in the US that many religious people have no idea about human spirituality, but they do have a deep sense of religious institution. My feeling is that Europe generally has a better notion of spirit and its value. I believe the latter is more important than the former.

Kendal Bond, Eugene, Oregon, USA

The growing gulf may not be simply between secular and religious, but between modern, progressive, inclusive branches of mainstream dominations in the developed world (except American "red states") vs. rapidly growing, fundamentalist Christian and Muslim movements based in the Africa, Asia, and European immigrant communities. A good example is the split between the US Anglican congregations that ordain gays vs. African-based Anglican ministries that reject gay ordination.

Michael Hendler, Vienna, Va.

Americans are religious extroverts and Europeans are religious introverts. Europeans see spirituality as intensely private, perhaps something only discussed with family and co-religionists. History makes it so. Americans, on the other hand, are as proud of their religion as they are their nationality. They're intertwined. Both approaches seem to work just fine. It's not surprising, however, that there's friction.

Brendan Marcotte, Montreal, Quebec

Europe's "morality" – based on humanism rather than in the existence of the Creator – is fundamentally flawed as it has no moral absolutes. This paves the way for the rise of the Anti-Christ in a future European superstate as prophesied in the Bible.

Sam Benjamin,Toronto,Canada

France's banning of the veil appears overblown to us, but with their very large population of Muslim immigrants and their very long memory of European history, they are fearful. We have not endured the European experience with religious oppression: Christian against pagan, against Protestant, Christians and Protestants against Jews; and now the possibility of a Muslim adversary. No wonder they prefer secularism.

Elizabeth Tang, Anaheim, USA

Europe is a godless, heathen [collection of nations]. Europe has drifted into a mindless frenzy of anti-Christianity. I do not see much difference between China's free speech record and European free speech record. ... The definition of free speech by Europeans includes speech that promotes anti-Christian ideas. ... Any speech that does not agree with the liberal agenda is called all manner of ugly names.

I am not a prophet, but Europe is going to experience the same thing that civilizations before it who promoted lewdness in the name of civil liberty experienced. What a tragedy! How are the mighty fallen and the weapons of morals perished. ...

I am African and I like it that way. God bless you! Or shall I say "blank bless you" to be politically correct.

Chinedu Emmanuel, Lagos, Nigeria

I do think that the US will experience a backlash against the religious right. This country is also experiencing a growing secular and muslim population. This country was built on the separation of church and state. The religious right is currently pushing the limits of that separation. In a generation the US will look at lot like Europe does today.

Enrique Zuniga, Chicago, Illinois

When I went to school in Heidelberg, Germany, in the late sixties, there was a strong feeling among Europeans that religion was dying because the governments were taxing people to support the churches, rather than depending on individual contributions. The result of this was that very few people felt responsible for contributing to their church, or valuable as a member.

Robin Kadz, Calgary, Alberta, Canada

Is there a connection between religion and morality? America is undoubtably more religious and yet it can look the other way when Bush fabricates WMD, lies, and kills 100,000 people. America goes to church on Sunday, but on the other six days it enjoys a lifestyle that is sustained by the suffering of the rest of the world. Religion and morality: I don't see the connection.

R. Ipock, California, USA

Due to the diveristy of world religions, Europeans believe that the only way to ensure fairness is to keep the public sphere secular and make religion a spiritual and private issue. Most of them would view the competition among American politicians to be seen as more religious than their opponent hypocritical and harmful.

In the Bible itself, Christ warned of those who will use his name for evil purposes. As long as American voters continue to care more about politicans' public position on religion and less about the true nature of their policies, the gulf between Europe and the United States will grow wider. Many Europeans already believe that they no longer share the same values with America.

Jin Lu, Munster, Ind., USA

Two points:

1. For hundreds of years Europeans were caught up in tragic struggles that directly resulted from the intertwining of religious and political power. Add to that the more recent carnage of the 20th-century and it's not surprising that people are skeptical of religious institutions.

2. The USA may be better off economically at this juncture, but it remains to be seen what the increasing disparity between the wealthy and poor will mean in the years to come. For a country that supposedly embraces religious values, is it not surprising that its people eschew social programs for lower taxes? And what is to be made of a religiously inclined society that defines success primarily in its ability to acquire and consume?

Brad Richmond, Holland, Mich.

I believe Europeans are very wary of institutional religion, and rightly so. The core values of Christ are not the expression of institutional religion. The Europeans moved away from the church, because the church has refused to move and find a way to address spiritual questions and needs for these times.

Jean McMahon, Denver, Colo.

Through many centuries, Europe has seen the best of religion and unfortunately, the worst. They have also struggled with multiculturalism much longer than the USA.

I think as a whole, many of these countries are striking a balance between the many religions by having a strictly hands-off approach. For the most part, it is working. As a deeply religious person, I have no problem with a government/society that observes a separation of the secular and religious lives of its citizens.

It is the goodness in people that matters. As far as the work ethic is concerned, religion seems to have no real effect. France and other countries have great productivity rates. The USA is not #1. Working more does not necessarily mean working better.

Liz Lewis, Montgomery, Ala., USA

Nazi Germany, Marxist Russia, and various French Republics have killed more people than all the religious wars combined, and are the reason Europeans no longer trust the state with the death penalty. With the decline of belief as recorded by Matthew Arnold and Fredrich Nietzsche, Europeans have been the all-too-willing executioner of anyone who they felt stood between them and security, ideology, nationalism, or whom they took a dislike. ...

If Europe becomes responsible for its own defense, the society that emerges may veer more towards that of the US.

Joe Mahoney, Natick, Mass., USA

The notion that freedom and constitutional government in either Europe and the US are products of the Enlightment is an historic misperception. The concepts of habeus corpus, trial by jury and representative institutions like the English Parliament, the Spanish Cortes, etc. emerged in the soil of medieval Christendom, not in the 18th-century. Neither was the Magna Carta written in the 18th-century!

The main product of the Enlightenment was the 'three Gs', guillotines, gulags and gas chambers! The totalitarian ideologies, which destroyed the lives of millions from the Atlantic to the Urals in early 20th-century Europe were militantly atheistic and secular. It is forgotten that this near destruction of Europe happened on a 'post-Christian' continent, whose public and intellectual life had been steadily de-Christianized for over a century. ...

The prospect of a new phrase of de-Christianization is frightening, particularly as the rising secularist ideologies are merely warmed-up versions of those 19th century versions, which wrought such havoc.

Charles Carroll, Dublin, Ireland

Most European countries have a strict constitutional partition between state and religion. Thus faith and worshipping are considered private matters that get little public exposure. The key religious institutions live primarily on taxes raised automatically and not from private donations. Most of those who are leaving churches don't want to pay the taxes, but are not necessarily giving up their faith. Small congregations live on donations but there are not many of them around. The broad social nets provided by the laws entitle the needy to state funds, making them independent from faith-based charities. As a matter of fact, especially the youth is increasingly religious.

G.O., Basel, Switzerland

Most Europeans have always been – and still are – caught in very restrictive systems, as compared to the relative freedom enjoyed by Americans in day-to-day life. As a consequence – and especially since World War I – they have developed a highly cynical view of anything representing authority (both secular and religious) to a degree that Americans have never experienced, except maybe for very short periods, and about rather limited subjects (Watergate, Vietnam, etc.).

Now, is the 'average' American anymore of a saint than the 'average' European? I doubt it. Even if he/she goes to church more often.

Pierre Brison, Namur, Belgium

I believe that the gap between Europe and United States is growing wider. That isn't happening only between Europe and United States. The same phenomenon is also present between US and Canada. ...

Nations like France and Canada have been oppressed by religion, which ruled for so long. 50 years ago, in Quebec, religion was side by side with the government, ruling and deciding on the moral values of the citizen, judging people, deciding on what book they'd read, what job they'd land. It was a pure dictatorship. That is why, now more than ever, people remember that and are afraid of religion, of being religious. Europe has had the same story.

I think that religion should stay in the private sphere and that it should not intervene with politics. Our decisions should be rational and not guided with religion.

It is time to really separate the church and the government... we see that this separation is becoming weaker and the line blurred in United States. For that, Europe feels it should reinforce its secularism. We should also not forget that the ideas of humanism come from religion, that it is with its own belief of charity and love of the other that religion forged what is pushing it aside. Man is taking back what it lost with religion: tolerance and the right to make rational decisions.

- Maxime Dupont-Demers, Montreal, Canada

My experience with my few British and European friends has been that religion is very private and is discussed only with close and trusted friends.

I think they follow the adage, don't discuss religion or politics in public, or with co-workers, or even most friends.

I am not sure this makes them less religious or more religious in the sense that they preserve expressions and practices of their faith, whatever it may be, as very personal.

I like that.

The bottom line is, does your faith lead you to respect and care for your fellow human beings? Everyday there are beautiful acts of faith that testify to this. I think we are shredding petals from the rose in search of what is there before us.

- Waddell Robey, Harrisburg, Pennsylvania, USA

The fact that Europeans work less than Americans has nothing to do with religion and more to do with devoting more of one's life to one's own enjoyment.

Brian Wilson, Charlotte, North Carolina, USA

There is no such problem as lack of values in our European societies. We all have the same Christian backgound, plus are shaped by the age of enlightenment, but as the sciences and education of the wider public proceeded over the past 150 years or so, the decline of religion playing a role in our lives was and is caused -amongst many other reasons- by the question of belief versus knowledge. We prefer the latter, you want to believe!

Sylke Kyas, Hannover, Germany

As a graduate student of US religious and intellectual history, I greatly appreciate this forum and look forward to the coming discussion. The first article is excellent.

But the implications of the title “Europe’s Struggle With Religion” are perhaps misleading. Certainly Europe is less religious than the US by any measure I have encountered, including church attendance, belief in God, the devil, hell, heaven, or biblical inerrancy; apart from these indicators is spirituality, which is difficult to measure and arguably irrelevant to the others. Indeed, the issue of religion in Europe and the United States could be equally well posed as “America’s Struggle with Secular Modernism.”

A fascinating paradox central to these questions is the relationship of America’s significantly higher rates of religiosity with higher rates of violence, crime, illegitimate birth, drug abuse, divorce, - just about any measurable aspect of sin, along with higher rates of poverty, illiteracy, and other such by-products of religiously-influenced social systems. Of the industrialized nations the US is the most religious and among the most crime-ridden, while Sweden is the least religious with the least crime.

While this does not prove that religion and sin go hand-in-hand, the correspondence is intriguing, and it shatters the notion widely held within America that belief in God is integral to morality.

These data beg the follow-up question to your survey: If religion induces the very behavior it is designed to reduce, what is its true function in America? Perhaps the spiritual dimension of religion, as opposed to its social-behavioral dimension, would in fact compliment Europe’s relative social tranquility; otherwise if secularism can bring reduced rates of social strife within Europe, why would Europeans want religion? These questions cannot be answered without addressing the function of religion within society.

- Jay Learned, Colorado Springs, Colorado, USA

America's schism with Europe regarding religion is an illusion. As with Islamic militancy, the loudest and most zealous always seem to speak for a few. Mainstream Americans and Europeans are more similar than traditional media alludes to. Political exploitation of religion rarely reflects a people, even in the most fertile democracies.

Matthew Gregory, Seattle, WA, USA

There is no longer a place in the world for Protestant Evangelism.

I see a small role ahead for fundamental religion, but a very large role for a world that will strongly embrace the spritual side of life. We can't continue to practice a religion that is based on ideas of one and two thousand years ago.

Fundamental religion is barbaric.

L. Burke, Oxnard, CA, USA

The more religion, the more wars, whether Baghdad or Washington. (Compare these to Sweden or Denmark). Religious beliefs deny reason and scientific knowledge. Reason is not permitted, social cleavages are generated on the basis of unsupported beliefs. People with differing beliefs are regarded as evil or at least ignorant.

- Ernie Fiedler, Vancouver, Canada